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Moving Money Around

April 21st, 2024 at 03:16 pm

I guess this is largely a MM(20) money update.  

I thought we would go over MM's cash during winter break, but he ended up not having much of a break.  I am surprised he still has any cash available, but he's been in extreme low spend mode and just stretching that $1K annual gift (using for spending money during college years).  We touched base during his spring break.  I think he had maybe ~$1,200 easily accessible cash.  He was very *shrugs* about it, just needs it to last 3 months.

MM(20) did decide that he was probably going to cash out some or all of his I Bonds.  But we decided to just wait and see what the next interest rate would be.  & we left it that he will need to open a new bank account this summer (to park extra cash).  

I just happened to notice two things last week:

1 - I Bond rate set for 2.97% inflation rate next round.

2 - One of our CUs is paying 5.5% interest.

The CU account is a mega interest account that was paying 4% when the average high yield interest rate was 1%.  It's fallen behind in recent months, but that 5.5% is perfect for MM(20) to park his I Bond funds.  The catch on this 'mega interest' account was that the cap was $5K for the mega interest.  

I can't even tell you why I checked, but maybe it's just because it's been so long since either of us has kept a full $5K in these accounts...  I figured I'd double check (if my memory was correct) and...  The 5.50% is on the first $10K! 

Note: We've already moved our own money over to take advantage of $10K @ 5.5%.

I let MM(20) know.  He is cashing out his I Bond and moving most of that to his CU account.  When all is said and done, he will have $10K earning 5.5%, $500 earning 7% (another CU), and $1,500 left in his checking account.  Maybe only $1,000 left after a few more months of college spending.  He will want to figure out a higher-balance high yield savings account at some point, but won't be necessary until he gets a job and starts piling up more money. 

In other news, MM(20) has had his rental figured out for next year, for a while, but was still negotiating the cost of the bedroom he will be renting.  I guess he got that sorted out and he told me it will be $808/month.  He will be saving $42/month, for a much bigger room and nicer neighborhood. 

Somewhat related, we need to cash out the rest of our I Bonds.  I have been dragging my feet because I got used to the easy separate buckets of money.  But I think I've only really been allocating this money to the kids 50/50 (in my mind) while it was doled out 50/50 into separate I Bonds.  The truth is that this is a '2 in college at the same time' fund.  I just needed a little time to wrap my brain around it.  I am thinking about loosely earmarking $20K for future DL(18) rent expenses.  & then earmarking the rest to MM(20).  I would earmark all of the mega I Bond interest to MM(20).  & also all future interest to MM(20), who is currently paying rent.  This is very simplistic and easy to keep track of.  I really only care about keeping the $20K for DL(18) if he is moving out this summer/fall (and if we are paying two years of rent for two college kids at the same time).  So if we end up falling a little short, this $20K is money we can probably tap if MM(20) needs it.  (At current, DL has no plans to move out.)

I wasn't sure if we would pay for MM(20)'s 5th year of college rent.  We left it as a bridge to cross later.  I wanted to give him ample notice if we expected him to chip in.  But at the same time, wanted to give it some more time to see how things sorted out.  He did his part.  He's done a good job keeping rent costs down.  I suppose when I tell him we are going to pay for the rent, will have to clarify that we can cover rent 'at this rent level'.  (We also found out his 5th year of tuition will be free, because adding the 5th year is giving him a 4th year grant.  I could just pull the 5th year of rent from his gifted college fund, if I wanted or needed to.  Now that we expect he might have anything left in there).

MM(20)'s current lease ends in July and I think the new lease starts August 1?  But he will be able to store his stuff there in the meantime.  MM(20) expects to stay at this house his last 2 years of college.  With everyone I know who rents being constantly kicked out by selling landlords...  I would never presume he could actually stay there 2 years.  But it would be nice if it works out.  Just my past experience re: sky high real estate.  It doesn't help that home sales just went from 0 to 100 overnight.  But I would have laughed at the idea of counting on this rental for 2 years, regardless.  We can only hope that it is that easy. 

Middle Class Financial Aid Calculations

March 30th, 2024 at 03:03 am

My kids both received substantial middle class grants from our State this year, re: attending in-state public Universities.

I've tried to look this up (how to ballpark or estimate) in the past, but it's so complicated and depends on so many factors.  Primarily, how many students are eligible.  Because then funds are divided among eligible students.

So my mind was just blown when I figured it out.  🤯  I just had to dig a little deeper.

Side note:  It appears that the kids' assets are not being counted in this formula.

There's other parts to the formula, but calculations below are just what was applicable for our personal situation. 

This is how the calculation went for the 2023-2024 school year.


Note:  The cost of attendance is a ridiculous number that we do not pay.  $20K is a more accurate number.  $10K for tuition, $12K for housing, and maybe save $2K here at home re: less utilities and food costs.  Eating is not a college expense.  In this case, MM(20) spends way less on food at college than at home, so that is a cost savings for us.  (& utility savings might be a few pennies on top of that.)

& all students are expected to be able to contribute the $7,898 re: part-time or summer work.


Note:  The cost of attendance is a ridiculous number that we do not pay.  We paid $8,000 tuition and DL(18) has some increased transportation costs with the daily commute to the college.  The rest is food/housing allocated to 'students who live with parents', plus $3,000 misc. personal spending (nope). 

I guess the key is the 'Phase In Factor' and is decided every year based on the budget.  For now, the best I can presume is that the phase in factor will remain the same for 2024-2025.  There is a lower 24% factor being used to estimate financial aid for 2024-2025.  So that is the number the kids will get from their colleges.  & then they eventually finalize this % later in the year. I am going to use 36% (same as this year) as a rough estimate of the actual dollar amount.  It does not sound like the State has the budget to bump up this grant again next year.  Which is completely fine with me.  We are getting to a tipping point where more grant money means less college tax credits.  So it's all kind of the same in the end, for us. 

In the end, it looks like grant numbers will likely be the same next school year, unless CA budget numbers radically change that %.  & of course, MM(20)'s grant might be a big fat $0 (if the decide he is already a senior, based on their methodology).  I do not count on anything, but it's just nice to have a better idea how all of this is calculated. 

I now understand that DL(18)'s grant is smaller because he is living at home.  (& also because his college tacks on less fees). & I now know that it doesn't matter if either kid starts piling up assets (re: working or gifts).  & I confirmed that there is no '2 in college at the same time' adjustment for this particular grant (re: our personal situation).

I also had no idea how much assets were penalizing us.  I knew we were on the lower end of this income scale, so the $0 income adjustment makes sense.  For the assets, we are penalized $140 for every $10K we add.  I guess technically $280 (x2) while we have two kids in college.  It would clearly be pointless to have less assets.  That's less assets generating interest and stock market gains.  & of course, if we didn't have the assets, then we'd be tapping retirement funds or taking higher interest loans, etc., to pay for college.  Clearly we are better off just having *more* assets.  

I keep distinguishing the middle class grants because we knew it was pointless to plan for any (need-based) financial aid re: middle middle class income and in-state public colleges (very low cost).  That has gone as expected, but the middle class grants have gotten a big boost in the years since MM(20) started college.  It could end up being a $40K windfall (roughly $20K per kid).  & that is a really nice surprise.  

Side note:  MM(20) did get a nice one-year merit scholarship from his college.  I've since been told that is not a thing.  It was apparently a bit of a unicorn.  Just to add to the, "Well that was unexpected," which sums up all of my kids' financial aid.

The next chapter:  If I ever get to blogging about it.  I found out in the Fall that MM(20) is probably eligible for food stamps.  $300 per month!  We are going to apply this weekend.  Obviously should have applied sooner, but we are both in disbelief about it.  Not 100% sure, but will just have to apply and see what happens.  (Would have applied sooner if I knew 100% for sure that he was eligible.) These are also benefits being extended to the middle class.  

Edited to add:  Note to self:  The new FASFA form does not ask if a student plans to live with parents.  Just read somewhere it's up to the school to get that information and report it for our middle class grant?  Something I will need to keep on top of when DL(18) moves out.  Will want to make sure we get the extra grant dollars if we are paying for rent.

Big Picture College Update

March 23rd, 2024 at 01:51 pm

I wanted to repost this because have had a lot of questions in recent years about things addressed in the past.  

Our Big Picture feelings about college, per 2017 post:


Of course, I could see how it would be interesting to update how things have shaped up, 7 years later. 

We both agree that we expect the kids to work significantly during high school and college, that our own financial health comes first, and that we don't want to borrow a penny for college. We don't want them to graduate with any student loan debt. We are willing to help our kids in any way we can as long as we are within these parameters.

2024 Update:  Tried to be open minded, but couldn't ignore the 'cost pennies colleges that everyone recruits from'.  Both our kids ended up different State colleges, but are basically the third generation in our family to take advantage.

Our kids aren't working as much as we envisioned.  One thing I don't think I said in this particular blog post was that our city has generally always been terrible on the employment front, and I of course recognize that an engineering degree might take more commitment than our business degrees did.  That said, I think the pandemic is mostly what torpedoed my kids teenage working years.  MH and I were very much, "You don't need a teen job around crowds of people."  But also, there is an element of the kids not needing to work.  MM(20) had a couple of strong working summers and has $10K+ saved up.  With his grandparents helping, I feel very *shrugs* about him not working at all in 2023.  DL(18) is a little further behind the curve and probably more impacted by the pandemic.  

I think the point of my original post is we expected our kids to work and contribute.  (Wasn't planning to buy them cars and pay for all their college expenses).  But with grandparents giving them this gifted college fund and helping them, has bought them a lot of freedom not to work.  I personally don't have any problem with it.  I wouldn't personally just do all the work and pay for everything, but if the grandparents want to do that, more power to them. 

Both my kids announced this winter that they were bored and they intended to work this school year.  MM(20) wants to do all the things and so it took him 2+ years to get settled and figure out his priorities.  But he knew he would have a lot of time in winter and spring quarter.  I forwarded him an internship opportunity (for this summer) that pays $40/hour.  If he could land that, he could make $10K in 6 weeks.  Something like that.  I am all for "working smarter, not harder".  DL(18), I strongly encouraged to not work in the fall, to ease into college.  He has thrived his first semester of college and he announced towards the end of fall semester that he was bored and could definitely work.  He might not be able to find a low hours job (like an on campus job) until next fall.  He did find a temp job and made about $1,300 this year already.   I will feel a lot better about DL(18) once he finds a steady job and has enough savings to buy a car.

We personally have not tied up this money (re: gifted college funds) in college type funds because we don't have any incentive to. We would rather have free use of the money. We don't have a big enough income, but I do have enough tax knowledge, to not bother with 529 plans or other college savings options. To be clear, we are not paying any taxes on these investment gains. So we don't need the trade-off of extra hoops to jump through for tax breaks that we don't need.

Along the same lines, MH and I both used our "college money" for a home down payment instead. In a state where college cost pennies and housing costs are sky high, I think it seems very likely our kids will experience the same. So I don't want to be penalized for tying up their gift money for college when they more likely will use it for post-college housing. Ideally, we'd actually really like to pay it forward and save this in-law money to give them as a lump sum *after* college. I don't know if we will be able to swing it, but this is what we would like to do. & if we can't, we definitely want to do something like this for our grandkids. (I think if it was not for the in-law money, this would just be a "pay it forward to grandkids" goal).

2024 Update: DL(18) is currently on the 'living at home' plan and on track to use 100% of this college money after college.   As of today, I think MM(20) might have $5K or $10K left after getting a 5-year degree.  Very likely $0.  He chose a much more extravagant college experience (5 hours away, in paradise).  & even DL(18), who knows.  The kid I thought maybe would never get more than a AA degree, he told me the other day he might want a PhD.  He might find a way to use his $30K for college.  I do have their gifted college funds parked in cash, while we expect to use all of the funds (MM) and while DL's plans are still so up in the air.  We can talk about longer term plans for this money as longer term plans crystalize.

In 2014 we were in a position to start putting money away into taxable investment accounts again (in addition to fully funding IRAs). I guess college is the only goal at this point, besides retirement. Though I don't consider this *all* to be college money, it is certainly accessible if we need it for college. We are putting away about $7,500 per year. I think matching the in-law college money is a good place to start. It probably works out too that we will probably get there in another couple of years. At that point we may just back off and figure that $40,000/each is a phenomenal start. I think we'd probably most likely just focus on cash flowing the rest (if there is anything left to cash flow).

2024 Update:  For MM(20), we've had a lot of windfalls to help with his rent.  Pandemic funds and unemployment covered his first year of rent. & the in-laws have been giving us some gift money after they received an inheritance.  

Our investments ended up getting to $40K and we have earmarked all of this money for college.  Won't necessarily use it all, but have it earmarked for now ($20K per kid, to cover rent).  I lost my job in 2018 and took a big pay cut, but also gained a work retirement plan.  So we stopped adding to taxable investments (and was not able to match the gifted funds, which ended up being $30K per kid).  I only added snowflakes (credit card rewards) 2018-2022.  The money did get a big boost when I put it in I Bonds for much of 2022-2023.  We turned $40K into $45K (while keeping the principal safe).  I don't know if anything has ever come that financially easy to us.  It seems there's always some obstacle or headwind, so I am really delighting being in the right place at the right time, just having this wad of cash for I Bonds when interest rates were nearing 10%.

I was able to resume (more significant) taxable investing in 2023.  Our investment account just hit $10K.  After saving for college, I wanted to save up $10K for MM(20)'s jaw surgery and related round of ortho.  I didn't feel comfortable crossing off his college as 'done and paid for' until we had this covered.  Not that it is a college expense, but it's a final expense we wanted to cover for him before he flies the nest.  So I am eyeing this $10K and wondering if I should just call it.  But I will wait for MM's grant to sort out his senior year (still not sure about that) and will wait for his lease to be finalized and to have real numbers.  By the end of the year I should have a plan and/or be able to call it.

Edit:  With the I Bond gains, the kids ended up with about $53K/each.  Which yes, was a phenomenal start.  That's $30K gifted funds ($1K per year, built up up over time), and $23K (our investments 2014 -2018 --> cash --> I Bonds --> back to cash).  DL's money is completey untouched, as mentioned.  But I have started to spend down MM's money from this $53K peak.  

& to be clear, the investment account is up to $10K after completely starting over.  (I can see that wasn't clear when I typed that out).  'College' money is all in cash.  But we have been able to resume adding to taxable investments (more than just snowflakes) in the past year.

Since I worked my way through college, I think the idea of MH working + kids working seems easiest on some level (would be a LOT of cash that we could put towards college). But, I think the "saving ahead" is important just because you never know. Relying on future income streams is a little outside of my comfort zone. So while some part of me thinks that "cash flowing with several jobs" is really the most obvious and the easiest, we always have a Plan A + Plan B + Plan C, etc.

2024 Update: Plan A is working out pretty nicely.  I mean, I am happy to have the "saved ahead" I Bond money too.  But also, we are hitting some of our highest income years while our kids are in college, and so that is going pretty well.  I stand by my decision not to divert large amounts of assets to college savings (or anything at all when my kids were very young).  We started saving when we had the money and are mostly cash flowing with higher income during these college years.

Note:  We are mostly using 'saved ahead' money to pay for MM's tuition/room/board (the more expensive college) while we have two in college at the same time.

We did also park extra money in ROTHs that we have never touched (starting when the kids were babies).  I never would have put that much money in retirement otherwise, but was okay with it knowing we could use this money for college.  I would have also been fine lowering retirement savings during these college years.  Plan B was always, "We don't have to mega save for retirement".

Final thought:  I've already said this many times before, but is worth mentioning.  We planned for full sticker price (roughly $30K) for the State colleges.  These college tax credits and middle class grants did not exist when I went to college and I never counted on any of this money.  The grants and credits will bring the net cost of MM(20)'s degree down to about $15K and DL's degree will cost $5K (or maybe $15K if he takes 5 years).  This is just a nice surprise that we did not plan for. 

Also, I don't expect to be saving any more money for college after 2024.  I think we will move on to other financial goals because we will be DONE.

MM(20) Tuition Update

March 11th, 2024 at 03:45 am

I've revised MM's estimated college costs, below.  I also kept the old numbers (to the right), for reference.


MM's expected net college costs:

$42,000 Tuition/fees** (4 Years)

+$10,000 5th Year Tuition/Fees 

-12,000  Tax credits  (-10,000)

-21,000  CA middle class grants (-13,000)

-  6,000  Scholarship


$13,000 Net cost  ($23,000)

**I added in MM's $1K summer school class


I won't believe it until I see it, but I now believe that MM's 5th year will be entirely paid for with state funds and tax credits.

So, I just completed the kids' FASFAs for next school year (was delayed this year due to major revisions; I waited for all the kinks to work out before I bothered with it.)  I logged into DL's account to make sure his GPA was reported by his high school. 

I am still so confused because MM(20)'s state grant changed from '3 years' to '4 years' at some point.  It was expected he would only get 3 years of grants re: college credits he went into college yet.  He was already considered a sophomore when he started college (per state grant measures, but he would need a minimum of 4 college years to complete an engineering degree).

So I asked MM(20) to double check today while we had a video call.  (He set up his own account; I don't have access).  I also needed his college tax form, so was just taking care of business.  It is still very clearly showing that he will get a middle class grant next year (Year 4).  He told me that he is pretty sure that changed when he made his double major official (end of last school year).  Which is *why* he is taking a 5th college year.  So, wait.  This means his 5th year will cost $0!  If that's the reason and this is true, that is pretty sweet.  I mean, he's getting a whole free year out of the deal of adding one more year of college.   

I am still skeptical and will believe it when the money hits our account.  

I also (at some point) crunched the numbers on a Year 5 college tax credit and it was a lot more than I expected.  A full $2,000.  & so I also added that to my estimate, and that will bring the net Year 5 cost down to $0.

In the end, net tuition/fees will be the same difference, if it takes 4 or 5 years.  

I will have to check if MM(20) anticipates taking any more summer classes.

MM(20) Gifted college Fund

March 8th, 2024 at 02:41 pm

This is a Part 2 re: my last post.  Realized I should have mentioned this with that post.

I am enjoying actually making interest on our cash. The 'Gifted College Fund' interest covered all of MM's college expenses during his junior year.  

Interest received this school year: $950

Net Tuition Paid (after tax credits): $743

Class supplies purchased separately:  $185

In the end, interest will roughly equal costs this school year.

(I actually skipped a $241 reimbursement, I think in December when I got my work bonus.  So I only deducted $687 from college fund this school year.)

We didn't pull any expenses from the college fund freshman year.  (We didn't intend to, but I think our net cost was $0 that year.)  We pulled out $5,000 to cover Sophomore year expenses (we had less middle class grants & scholarships that year).  $20,000 remains in this college fund.

I expect that MM(20) will have $0 left when he is done with college.  His state grants are probably exhausted (this is still very unclear, but likely those funds will dry up).  & he's added a 5th year, so will be a couple of roughly $10K years of paying full tuition.  He understands that his choice to pay 5 years of rent in a high cost region, this means that he will not have any (gifted) funds left at the end.  Choosing a very affordable State college still has many benefits, like MM(20) not having to work at all.   Or us feeling *shrugs* about the 5th year. 

Note:  I have no plans to touch DL(18)'s gifted college fund, as long as he is living at home and paying roughly $1K per year tuition.  If not used for college, it's his money to do whatever he wants with it. 

College 2023 - 2024 ✔

March 6th, 2024 at 04:42 pm

The last week (er, two weeks) have been a whirlind.  Mostly good things.  MM(20) visited for dinner Friday night (over one week ago), we went to GMIL's 99th birthday party that Saturday, and MH got home from his trip that Sunday night.  I paid off the travel credit card bill.  We ended up using exactly that $3K gift money to cover the cost.  (The goal was to cover a chunk of the costs.  It's just gravy that it covered everything.)  More details later, if I ever have any time.  I had family visiting from the mid-west and MH needed to help his GMIL with a new computer, so we were in the Bay Area this past weekend. 

I've got 2023-2024 college year mostly wrapped up.  I mentioned (re: annual goals) that this won't be a big college expense year.

DL(20) received his state financial aid check/refund last week.  So now I have a better idea the flow of things.  Refunds arrive 11/1 & 3/1, roughly.  

I received a $2,000 refund (spring semester) from DL's college and a $1,074 bill (spring quarter) from MM's college on the same day.  I paid MM's tuition and checked off on my side bar that his third year is done and paid for.

Note:  $2,000 is the net I should owe for DL's fall semester.  Will just park the money in savings to cover the rest of his college expenses this calendar year.  In the short run, the $2K will let me cash flow MM's tuition before I reimburse myself from various buckets.  This semester thing is a lot more simple than the quarter thing.  

For MM's tuition, I am cash flowing the tax credit ($833, or 1/3 tax credit).  I have the benefit of reduced taxes, to pay this portion of tuition.  The remaining $241 I will pull from MM's gifted college fund. 

I did also cash out two of the I Bonds (end of 2023) and am able to reimburse myself monthly for MM(20)'s rent.  We have never had more than a roughly 1% interest rate (or some promo deals on smaller amounts of savings) during our adulthood.  I more viewed the I Bonds as an investment (that was mega interest for a while).  Turned maybe $20K of savings into $22K+ for MM's college expenses (woohoo)!  But now that I am cashing that out, I am really enjoying having some decent interest rates on our cash.  Any incidental college expenses that MM(20) has at this point should just be covered by interest.  This is also how I am funding his utilities.  I am leaning towards just hiring a cleaner (with this interest money) when MM's lease ends.

In other news.  Very cautiously optimistic but...  It sounds like the girlfriend is bouncing back?  She told me that she unexpectedly felt well for a whole 5 days and that she was traveling to visit MM(20) for a couple of days.  She is doing so well that those 'couple of days' has turned into 2 weeks.  MM was just telling me she extended her stay so that she could go down to LA and visit her cousin's baby or something like that.  I had no idea if they found some underlying condition (had more answers), found meds that worked, or what happened.  I spoke to MM(20) a couple of days ago and he told me that she is just getting better, as they said would happen.  They just didn't know if it would take months or years.  My recollection is that she has been down for 5 months.  It sounds like she is putting this chapter behind her.

It's Official

December 3rd, 2023 at 05:52 pm

Yes, the state wants to give us $11,000 for college this year.  MM(20)'s fall quarter refund finally showed up.  I wanted to pay his winter tuition that week, so the timing worked out perfectly.

I believe it now.  It's real.

Here's an update of MM's expected college costs, with the 5th year.  He did officially get his double major approved and so 5 years is the plan.  

MM's expected net college costs:

$42,000 Tuition/fees** (4 Years)

+$10,000 5th Year Tuition/Fees 

-10,000  Tax credits

-13,000  CA middle class grants

-  6,000  Scholarship


$23,000 Net cost

**I added in MM's $1K summer school class


Of course, nothing is easy.  *sigh*

The girlfriend is still very ill.  I just looked back at texts and it's been 6 weeks since MM(20) first took her to the hospital and she was hospitalized.  She's been in and out of the hospital this whole time and they don't know what is wrong with her.  This became more apparent during Thanksgiving week when MM(20) was home and he filled us in more on what was going on (and he was probably more in the loop; the girlfriend has moved back home in our city for the meantime).  I presumed she was on the upswing but I texted her about something or the other yesterday and she told me she was having a bad day and was being put on heart meds.  Very short term, I am sure that they are starting to wonder if she can feasibly go back to school in January.   Longer term, lord knows.  😟 


MM(20) Money Update

October 22nd, 2023 at 02:10 am

MM(20)'s mega I Bond interest expires the end of November.  Will cash out and move to his high interest savings account.  It used to be 'mega interest', but is below average these days.  & the cap is $5K (on what used to be mega interest).  I just put it on my calendar to have him open a high yield cash account when he is home for Thanksgiving break.

This reminds me, I've seen that Chevy is starting to release Bolts that they bought back during the recall.  Put in new batteries and these cars have brand new 8-year warranties.  They've been flooding the market, similar to how it was when we bought the car (we bought when they were coming off lease and flooding the market.)  The pricing is similar, at $15,000.  The kicker is that today there is a $4,000 used EV tax credit.  This could be a $11,000 car purchase, plus tax on the larger sticker price.  It's a little early and I know that it's more than MM(20) wants to spend.  But I thought he might be enticed by the very inexpensive fuel (which would probably mostly be free.) 

I wouldn't buy one of these cars before 2024, and we'd maybe miss the boat.  Why 2024?  Because dealerships will be able to advance the tax credit.  So no more wondering if uncooperative dealerships are going to figure out their crap.  $4K off the top or we walk.  & also, the new rules will be much more lax.  Many instances where you can take the credit up front and not have to pay back if you are not eligible.  I'd have to do homework on that.  There is a 20-page IRS FAQ that I have not looked at in any great detail.  But I get the jist that all is this is going to be much easier and more favorable in 2024.  I still expect dealerships to be uncooperative and mostly clueless.  But the up front tax credit will be make or break the deal for the 20yo.  Who most definitely does not want to spend $15K on a car.

I brought it up, but MM(20) told me he doesn't want a car next school year.  That's news to me!  The only thing of note that has changed is that he has a bike this year.  He may be finding that is more than enough, for transportation. 

The other big financial update is that MM(20) has committed to a 5th college year.  He was a little wishy washy about his major and changed it a couple of times.  Finally decided he just wants to double major.  So that will take 5 years.  There's some non-academic reasons also for him wanting to take 5 years.

I can very much relate.  Very different reasons, but I also had several reasons I took 5 years to finish college.  So I asked MM(20) early this calendar year if he thought he would finish in 4 years.  I was surprised when he said yes.   At that time we told him we had both taken 5 years to finish college.  I am glad we had this discussion because I want him to do it right the first time.  I think he felt like he had to finish in 4 years.  & so he started considering this other major when he had more time (I think he'd need 4.5 years to switch?)  & then after getting two major changes approved, he just got approval to just double major in both of those majors.  

Of course, I think this would have been around when he would be deciding if he wanted to do a 5th year Masters program. (Another reason I didn't just presume he'd be done in 4 years). Some of this decision is that he doesn't want to do a Masters program at all.  I am surprised, but makes it an easier sell.  If he's really going to be done with all his schooling in 5 years, this is a pretty good deal.

The tuition part is easy.  He's got just about enough cash left in his gifted college fund to cover Years 4 & 5 (when he won't be eligible for grants any longer; no tax credit that 5th year).  This is exactly what the gifted college fund is for.  To give him more options. 

As to housing, I have no idea.  It's years away and so we will keep saving.  It could be that we expect him to contribute more during that 5th year.  I just don't know how that will shake out.  It also could likely be moot.  I have two years of rent saved up for DL(18) already.  It's how it's always been with my kids.  MM(20) was the one who always wanted to do 2 or 3 extra-curriculars while DL(18) wanted to do zero.  MM wanted to go on all the big trips while DL didn't want any part of that.  MM wants to go to school 300 miles away.  DL needs a slower transition into adulthood.  It might just be the ying/yang it always is.  I've always been able to afford all this for MM because his brother is uninterested.  & so it might just be how college shakes out too.  I've got rent money saved that DL(18) might not end up using.

In the meantime, I just keep saving for these college years.  

MM(20) College Stuff

September 6th, 2023 at 02:16 pm

I discussed with MM(20) and we are just going to send him a $1K monthly allowance for rent and groceries.  Just for simplicity, as we switch to monthly housing costs.  I was just paying quarterly (with tuition) when he lived in the dorms.  

MM(20) only spent ~$80/month on food last school year.  🙄  & he looks starved.  So I am leaning on him to spend more.  I don't know that he will spend more, but I am trying.  I will be sending him a flat $150/month for groceries. 

Why $150?  Because it makes it an even $1,000 per month, with rent.  & I presume that about doubling his grocery budget should be more than ample.

I saw a conversation in the parent group recently, about what to expect to pay for food (for kids living in apartments with kitchens).  $400 - $600 was pretty much all that anyone recommended.  😲  I just presumed that included eating out costs, but there were comments about how "this can be done if you meal plan" and stuff like that.  Still, clearly has to be some eating out costs.  MM(20) never eats out, and I expect that is most of why he keeps food costs down so low.  

There was even a comment how if you don't give your kids at least $500/month, it's not fair to roommates because obviously your kid would have to steal their roommates' food.

I often feel like I live on a different planet, and this is one of those moments.  The only relateable comment was someone who has a $250/budget for their kid who shops at Costco.  If I can get MM(20) to actually spend $150.  & I know a lot of it is that he gets a lot of free food from the girlfriend, and some free food from clubs and so one.  I expect $250/month would be a decent grocery budget for MM(20) if he didn't have the 'free food' factor. (They aren't eating ramen.  They are eating 4-course meals.  The girlfriend is quite a chef.)  Not only that, but they also take turns cooking for 2 (or more), which clearly helps to reduce their food costs.  

It will be interesting to see how this year goes.  With less roommates and me pushing him to spend more on groceries, he may spend a little more.  He doesn't have to share a kitchen and fridge with 4 other people.  That should allow for more cooking and leftovers.  More room for leftovers, if nothing else.

The question mark this year is utilities and other expenses.  Moving from an "absolutely everything is covered with rent" situation to a "nothing is covered with rent" situation.  But the utilities should be so minimal that I think I may just reimburse him twice during the school year.  & once I have a year of utility data, might just roll that into a flat monthly allowance for future years.

The school had even covered cleaning supplies, so that will be a new expense this year.   I don't know how much MM(20) will pay for laundry this year and how much he will just do laundry at the girlfriend's house.  (Laundry was always free in the dorms).  I am sure there's things we have not thought of.

I did give MM(20) his $1K college gift this year, to use towards furnishing his apartment.  Seemed the best use of this money for this school year.  In the end, he's found everything for free.  He even had a free bed/mattress at some point (that fell through).  & he found a free bike.  As of this moment, he still needs a mattress.  & he might need some kitchen stuff, depending on what the roommate brings.

MM(20) Tuition Update

September 6th, 2023 at 02:46 am

MM(20) had an estimated $4K state (middle class) grant per his college.  I mentioned in a prior post that $4K was my "pulled out of my butt" estimate and didn't know what to make of it.  His grant had been $2K his first year, then $3K.  Well, it sounds like the school basically used my estimate method.  Figured he might get another $1K this year. 

In the meantime, MM(20) was out of town for the long weekend.  I cornered him when I got home from work and had him log in to check his grant.  The dollar amount went up by $4,000 this year.  What the heck!?

I had read somewhere over the summer that "the dollar amount depends on the specific school."  But I was second guessing this when DL(18) wound up with the $4K amount.  I just presumed both the kids would get the same $4K amount.  I was stunned when MM's grant came in at $7K!  

MM's expected net college costs:

$42,000 Tuition/fees**

-10,000  tax credits

-13,000  CA middle class grants

-  6,000  Scholarship 


$13,000 Net cost

**I added in MM's $1K summer school class, so brings the grand total tuition to $42,000.  

The one thing that is really unclear is if MM(20) will get any further middle class grants.  The state is treating MM(20) like a senior because he started with so many AP/IB credits.  For planning purposes, I presume this is all the financial aid he will get. 

I suppose you never know how things will sort out with future scholarships and everything.  Lord knows I was surprised this year. 

At the end of the day, this grant is an extra $3,000 in MM(20)'s pocket.  I was paying his tuition from his gifted college fund.  With this news, he should end his junior year with $20K cash (gifted college fund), same as he has now.  I think technically will be pulling out ~$800 for tuition this junior year, but he will be able to make that back (in 12 months) with higher interest rates on cash account.  If there's anything left after college, this money is for him.

Edite to add:  Have been told that the college will sort out grants end of October.  Hopefully before we pay the next quarter.  It will be hard to believe until the college deducts it from MM's tuition.

DL(18) Tuition

September 3rd, 2023 at 03:04 pm

Enjoying a nice bout of cooler weather.  & the clouds/sunsets that come with the cooler weather.

I got some more firm college numbers for DL(18).  Woohoo!

I've been following actual CSU college numbers (over the decades) and planning for $30K (sticker price) degrees for my kids. 

Actual cost = $30,400 at DL's specific college.  It looks like it will be closer to $32K with parking permits (over 4 years).  I am considering that as part of tuition/fees, since the parking is kind of necessary to be able to commute to the college. 

Up until this afternoon, that's all the info I had.  $32,000 degree minus $10,000 college tax credits = $22K max I expect to pay for this degree.  

It sounded likely the kids would have similar state middle class grants, but I was second guessing because I recently read it depend on the college.  & for all I know, DL(18) didn't get the paperwork in.  I don't know!  I had this number in April? when MM applied to college, but I didn't know if I'd get this number (for DL) until after I paid for DL's first year of college.  Or like 9 months later.  🙄 

But I saw the topic come up in the college parent group (MM's college) today and it looked people had real numbers.  What!?  

DL(18) got a $4K grant!   (I was able to log into his state grant account).  I am so relieved that everything went through. 

The best part is these grants are increasing every year.  Was more like $2K MM's first year.  Then $3K.  Then $4K.  

DL's expected net college costs:

$32,000 Tuition/fees

-10,000  tax credits

-16,000  CA middle class grants


$6,000 Net cost

Probably minus some increased middle class grants in the future, which could easily net out this cost to $0.  

Of course, it's not quite so simple.  The tax credit thing gets complicated.  If middle class grants increase any further, then the tax credits will decrease.  & I mean, we won't even get the full $2,500 tax credit this first year.  But I feel pretty confident saying that DL will probably pay no more than $5K for his degree (if he can finish in 4 years).  

It sounds like most likely I won't get any refunds from DL's school until next year.  His tuition (full sticker price) and parking permit will be $4,000 for the spring semester.  Due end of December maybe?  Early January?  But the school will owe me this $4,000 (grant) refund, so that should be a wash.  Because of this, I've checked off DL's freshman year as done and paid for.  In my sidebar.  The $4K cash already paid should be all I need to come up with for the next 11 months.  Phew!  Feeling relieved because the money drain was pretty crazy in August/September.  Paid college x2, medical bills, last minute vacation and so on.  

The planner in me is very happy.  We plan to just cash flow DL's college expenses (with income).  I didn't think it would amount to much more than $1,500 per year.  But it's nice to have firm numbers and a more firm plan.

DL(18) is just living at home, so no other college expenses to figure out.  I mean, he's got a bigger commute now, but he is covering those expenses.

MM(19) Updates

July 8th, 2023 at 01:37 pm

MM(19) got out of jury duty.  Didn't have to go in, and was freed Wednesday afternoon.  He bought train tickets the second he got the news, and headed to LA.  The prior weekend he went re: school club and had most expenses paid for.  Last weekend he visited the girlfriend, who has a job down there.  The train was pretty fast and it was cheaper than gas.  I gave him $40 for food.  Because the GF watched our cat while we were out of town, and refuses to take money.  So I told him to try to make her take the cash.  & if she won't, then to take her out to eat.  Or buy her groceries or whatever. 

I just noticed that MH's larger mega savings account bumped up to 4%.  It used to be 3.5% or something like that, when everyone else was paying 1%.  But they had been slower to adjust re: recent interest rates.  I moved my money out personally (it had dropped down to 2%), but I thought it might be worth MM(19) waiting it out.  That surely they would adjust.  I see now that they went up to 4% on April 1.  That works out well for MM(19).  He only has $2,000 in there right now, but he can put any summer earnings in this account.

I also noticed that MM(19) is done with 9.62% rate on I Bonds.  Will bump down to ~7% for the next 6 months.

MM(19) ends the school year with $937 more than he started with.

+$445 interest (10 months)

+$202 credit card rewards 

+$1,115 TA job (one quarter)

-$825 Misc. Spending**

Net = +$937 

**I don't have any details re: his spending.  It works out to spending ~$82.50 per month during the school year.  Off the top of my head, this would be contributing gas to GF and gas re: multiple trips to LA during the year (school club), meals out (mostly when on the road), toiletries, haircuts, and any personal spending, books and school supplies, etc.  Net of credit card rewards on his newer credit card (that I have no access to).

Not included above, I sent MM $800 for groceries.  That works out to $80 per month.  Which is ridiculous, compared to the $300/month he eats at home (in less expensive region).  🙄  

I know he gets a lot of meals from the GF.  If I thought literally he was only eating $80/month food, I'd be more concerned.  But I am guessing he gets at least $100/month of food from his girlfriend.  

We will have to have some discussions and figure out next year.  Paying rent quarterly to the school (with tuition), I have just been reimbursing MM(19) grocery expenses once per month.  But with the off-campus housing, I'd like to just send him a monthly allowance to cover room and board.  (Because will also be paying rent every month.  Just want to do one monthly reimbursement).  I think $150/month might be more appropriate for groceries, but want to make sure he is spending a little more and eating enough.  So we need to talk about that.

Bigger picture, MM(19) has $11,700.  & that's just more liquid cash.  He also has college funds and ROTH IRA.  Last we talked about it, he's thinking of buying a car next summer.  But he's been very wishy washy on this front.  He seems hell bent on going very cheap with the car.  Unfortunately, I don't think the 20yo kids' car has given him a realistic view on car expenses.  It didn't need a repair for the first 4 years (when he was paying for all of the expenses).  Dude, if your grandparents *and* your parents are happy to pay for your college.  Take the money and buy a nicer car that will last you a very long time.  We did too good of a job setting our kids' car expectations, but I didn't know they'd just be handed everything (car + college degree).  I think MM(19) could easily buy a $10,000 car that will last him a very long time (if he waits until he is 21 to buy a car).   

Well, I got sidetracked re: kid stuff.  I just wanted to see how the school year shook out for MM(19).  Before, I really had no idea how much spending money he would want/need re: college, and was tracking just to get an idea about things.  At this point, I have much less access to his finances and he's clearly got enough money to cover expenses.   The next chapter will be figuring out how to handle the monthly expenses next school year.  I should probably just transfer him rent money for July.  His first month rent must be due next week.  Off campus, he's stuck with a 12-month lease.  

I am checking where we are at with things.  I have $11,200 I Bonds set aside for MM's junior year rent.  In my mind it was $10K (original investment) and I only had 11 months of rent covered.  But I am going through the math and I think I have 12 months rent covered + about $85/month to cover utilities.   With the interest earned on these I Bonds. This is my big chore for next week.  I need to sort out insurance with the rental company and make sure MM(19) gets his first month's rent paid.  Utilities won't start to sort out for another few months.  

Of course, I am still getting ~7% on these bonds, so I won't be cashing any I Bonds out soon.  I will just cash flow rent and reimburse myself when the interest rate drops down (December).  I'll be draining our cash down in the meantime.  But mostly this is money we want to use to fund our IRAs (when the year is over).  So it works out pretty well.  I'll have a $6,000 chunk to cash out in December and will just move over to IRAs.  In 2024, I can just pay the rent with I Bond money every month.  

Even though the I Bond money is tied up for another 6 months, I am pretty happy with where we are at re: MM's college funds.    I am just presuming that he will get the usual $1K college gift from in-laws (this month) and will be able to use that money to furnish his apartment.  He's not going to need much and will mostly buy used.  I think we can stretch that money out to furnish his apartment and also get him a very used bike.  (No point spending any money on a nicer bike that will just get stolen).

Well, I started this post a bit ago.   I leaned on MM(19) to call the leasing office.  He needed to talk to a human because I don't think anyone plans to move in until September.  Found out he needed a cashier's check for the first month rent.  He just happens to be in the college town this weekend, so it worked out.  He had time to go to the CU and will drop off the check this weekend.

MM will be traveling to the college town two weekend in a row.  But the leasing office is closed weekends, so I don't know when he will ever get the key to his apartment.  He seems very "meh" about crashing in completely empty apartment.  Would rather just crash with friends in their nice furnished houses.  

(Yes, this was after two weekends in a row in LA.  He is alternating work trips with vacation trips.  I think next weekend is just a big birthday weekend.  I think he's staying at someone's fancy pants parent's house on the coast).

I put it on my calendar that I will need to start sending him rent money before the 1st of the month.  July was easy with the partial month, but I guess technically will need to send him a second bigger check this month, before August 1.

Done Saving for MM College?

April 24th, 2023 at 11:34 pm

MM(19) sorted out his housing, as I expected he probably would.  He was just being a little too *chill* for my liking.  While I worked on the backup plans for the backup plans.  But he had a few irons in the fire and I was giving it some time before I dove in too deep.  So it ended up taking very little time or mental energy on my part.

He found this rental the day after the RA position news.  But then he hit a red tape brick wall with the management company.  It took about 10 days but they finally let him apply.  (In the interim, I had given up on this option.)  He let me know Friday night that he had signed the lease.  

It was the Goldilocks option, as to price.  Not the most ideal situation overall.  But certainly could be worse.  Was otherwise considering a $500/month "job on campus" living option (that was problematic on multiple fronts) and a $1,500/month room.  Ended up in the middle.  He won't need a car, and it has a kitchen.  So these are all pluses.  I found a rental last week and then later realized it didn't even have a kitchen.  So I started wondering if that might be a sacrifice (which could end up being costly re: food costs).  But being able to not have a car is probably the biggest savings factor.   

Would prefer to just live on campus another year, but they have very few spots for juniors/seniors.  I mean like 500 spots for 10,000 students?  Something like that.  & they maybe also reserve some housing for transfer students.  

Wait.  Does this mean we are done saving for MM(19)'s college!?  With this rent locked in and knowing it will be so much easier the following year (with an earlier start)?

My first instinct is that I want to keep saving for the "crap happens" factor.  The obvious that comes to mind is if we do get stuck with this (whole) lease for any long period of time.  If the roommate backs out for any reason.  Stuff like that.  In addition to all the other infinite ways that crap can happen.

When this day did come, I thought I may take a breather before circling to finish off DL(17)'s college costs.  But now that I am here...  I will just keep saving, for whatever kid might need it.  I just want to be *done* so that we can move on to other things. I think DL(17)'s college costs are well covered.  But he is also my wildcard.  More likely to take longer, to drastically change plans later (finish school out of state), to drop out.  I don't know.  

So my first instinct is to just keep saving for whoever needs it. 

Then I remembered that MM(19) has a whole other round of ortho, plus surgery.  Should probably keep saving for that.  It's not college, but it's one last thing before he is self sufficient.  It kind of gets wrapped up in this ball of final costs (mostly college) before we are done financially supporting him.

I will ponder all this more as I formulate 2024 goals in December.  If it wasn't for the whole ortho factor, I'd probably just start a "for whoever needs it" college top off fund.   But I expect I will probably be leaning towards some more MM(19) savings first.

Not ready to call it yet, but getting very close!

Gifted College Funds

February 22nd, 2023 at 04:11 pm

We expected the economics to be the same for our kids as it was for us.  Cheap college.  Completely absurd post college housing costs.  We preferred to keep any "college money" for after their college years.  In the end, this is even more true for my kids.  They will pay less (than we did) for their college degrees. Housing has only gotten more absurd.

That said...  MH had the free ride but he also just lived at home during college years.  He told me he is not interested in saving MM(19)'s college fund while we pay for completely unnecessary luxury costs like housing 300 miles away.  The "Far away college" was not necessary to get him the same quality degree.  I am 100% on the same page.

For MM(19)'s freshman year I did not agree this was entirely fair, because MM received a (one-time) scholarship at this other college.  It would have cost him the same to live at home the first year.  But for this school year, I do appreciate the load off my shoulders.  Phew!   

We both want to leave some of this money for the kids, as long as they are choosing affordable degrees.  But for MM(19), it's just not going to be *all* of it.

We've been kicking the can down the road as much as possible.  Wanting to rely more on saved money when we have two kids in college at the same time.  & then all this financial aid delay during this school year.  Have been waiting for that to sort out.

But now it is time.  We agreed to cash flow MM(19)'s rent this year.  Food costs are just being carved out of our grocery budget (no new spending.)  & we will pull tuition from MM's college funds.  

The Gifted College Fund

This is a $1K annual gift from the in-laws, since birth.  MM(19) has probably received ~$20,000.  (I think one or two years might have been forgotten/skipped).  This gift has grown to $30,000 over time.  

I did give him the $1K gift for spending money this college year, but he just put this money in I Bonds (along with his earnings last year). 

In 2020 MM(19) had a big earnings year and we put $5K of this gift into a ROTH IRA.

This leaves him with $24,300 today, that is just sitting in cash.  

We paid $0 tuition last year and so we did not pull any money out from college funds.

We will pay $4,300 tuition this school year.  This works out pretty well.  I will draw this account down to $20,000, reimbursing ourselves for the $4,300 tuition.

I want to remember that with the ROTH IRA and the I Bond money, he technically still has $26,000 of this gift money left.  & he might receive another $2,000 from the in-laws during his college years ($1,000 x 2 years).

Next Year

DL(17) will most likely live at home and go to the local State college.  We will not touch his college fund.  I expect to pay ~$2,000 tuition in August and ~$2,000 tuition in January.

Note:  Will also get a $2,000 college tax credit; net cost is ~$2,000 for the year. 

We will pull MM(19)'s tuition from his college fund.  It will be $2,000 tuition in August, $2,000 tuition in November, and $2,000 tuition in February.

Note:  Will also get a $2,500 college tax credit back; net cost is $3,500 for the year.

I will cash flow the tax break, and so will pull ~$1,200 from MM's college fund every quarter.  I'd like to just reimburse ourselves every quarter, but will need more timely financial aid information in order to do that.  With two in college at the same time, I might err on just reimbursing what we actually pay and then putting back any financial aid refunds.  If it's anything like this school year was.

The above numbers presume $0 scholarships.


There's still a lot of unknowns re: next school year.

DL(17)'s situation is very cut and dry with the whole living at home thing. 

MM(19)....  Where to begin!

There is a lot that has to sort out re: housing.  He's trying to get free room/board or deeply discounted room/board re: RA position or other on-campus jobs.  He's trying to get on campus housing (as a backup plan.)   

Financial aid is supposed to be favorable with two in college.  This means nothing for DL(17) if he lives at home.  For MM...  I don't fully understand what this means.  If our "need" is $15,000, do they give us $15,000 next year?  I was going to say they've only offered us loans for negligible amounts of "need" in prior years.  But I guess to be fair, the school also knew that they were giving us scholarships and they knew the state was giving us aid.   In reality, "need" has been covered in past years. 

MM(19) might fare better with scholarships if he does demonstrate need.

I am just preparing financially re: what I do know, and any reduction in expenses will just be gravy. 

Update:  I transferred the $4,300 to our checking account and paid rent for the rest of the year.  I really enjoyed paying this expense with someone else's money.  😁  The rent bill just happened to match the $4,300 figure and I can pay it now.  I can't pay tuition until MM(19) registers for classes. 

Jan '23 Savings

February 15th, 2023 at 01:44 am

Received $94 bank interest for the month of January.

Received $246 I Bond interest for the month of January.


Snowflakes to Investments:

--Redeemed $36 credit card rewards (cash back) from our grocery card 

--Redeemed $96 cash back on Citi card

--Redeemed $21 cash back on dining out/gas card (& grocery rewards from Q4 2022)


Other Snowflakes to Investments:

+ $7 Savings from Target Red Card (grocery purchases)


TOTAL: $160 Snowflakes to Investments


Snowball to Savings:

+$1,300 MH Income

+$  250 MH Award Money (Script Contest)

+$1,130 College Refund 

+$1,050 State Inflation Relief

-$ 700 Stereo System + backup camera (kids' car)


401k Contributions/Match:



Savings (from my paycheck):

+$  250 to investments

+$1,000 to cash (mid-term savings)


Short-Term Savings (for non-monthly expenses within the year):

+$1,500 to cash

-$1,200 Home Insurance

-$  360 Auto Repairs (kids' gas car)

-$  210 Annual Movie Pass (Regal)

-$  175 Museum Membership


TOTAL: $4,898 Deposited to Cash and Investments



Hybrid Miles Driven:  605

Fuel Costs: $16 Electricity 

(assumed 50 miles & 14 KwH per full charge)


Electric (EV) Miles Driven: 1,516

Fuel Costs: $21 (home) + $46 (out)

(assumed 300 miles & 60 KwH per full charge)

Most charging (both cars) was done at home or at free chargers.

Lots of driving this month.  One college trip (round trip ~650 miles), one Bay Area trip (~250 miles) and then MH traveled about 140 miles roundtrip for a San Francisco trip.  He drove 70 miles and then took the train the rest of the way.

The hotel charging was expensive, $23 for a full charge.   Is more in line with gas prices.  But was worth it and very convenient to just charge up the car all the way, overnight.  The rest of the charging expenses will decrease substantially in the future, with warmer temps and more efficient EV tires.


Note:  I am always lagging a month behind because any bills charged in December will be paid off January 1 and reflected in my January numbers.  I charge in one month and the next month I figure out how to pay for everything (if I need to pull anything from savings).  So this update reflects December spending & January savings.

I chickened out about sweeping MH's income (above $1,000) to investments.  I am struggling with feeling a little "cash poor" after that big mortgage paydown.  We just bought a second set of new tires (when the first were a bust).  We will have fence replacement expenses soon.  & while in storm/fence/tree mode, will get our trees trimmed.  There's college expenses in February, and $12,000 I need to send to IRA for 2022. 

MH did unexpectedly receive some Holiday pay (for the week after Christmas).  I suppose some of this is moot because I didn't expect that MH would bring home much in January.  That was just a nice surprise, but we are also trying to get these tires covered.  With unexpected money, ideally. 

It should just be a short term stress.  Will add back some buffer quickly, these months that MH is working.  & college expenses should be pretty minimal until August.  I am going to pull some money out of college funds, for the first time.  Tuition for the whole (academic) year, which will offset MM's last rent bill for the school year.  & the two refunds I just received from the college will be all I need to cover tuition.  Just parking the refunds until it goes back out again. 

I had written off our inflation relief check as lost/stolen.  Tried to call three weeks ago.  Was told I had to wait until January 31st to get a replacement card.  The original showed up in the mail on January 30th.  Phew!  That would have been so irritating to cancel/replace and then just have it show up the next day.  I applied to the car stereo purchase, which was the original plan.  (I don't remember if that was the original original plan, but was easy to justify the stereo upgrade knowing that this money was coming.)  I suppose that works out pretty well.  The rest, and MH's unexpected Holiday pay, should cover most of the tire purchase. 

January was clearly a big cash boost, and I do appreciate it.  MH also finally got that $250 he won a while back.

I was just updating sidebar.  I am just going to call it.  MM(19)'s first two years of college paid for in cash.  I won't send the final 2022-2023 payments over for another few weeks, but clearly we have the cash to cover it.  Extra so, if I am just applying recent college refunds and pulling from college funds.  I put this *goal* more in my sidebar as a clarification.  The feeling of it is *shrugs*.  It's less of a goal and more just how we roll.  It's also fairly official that DL(17) will be the 4th person in our household to take advantage of CSU (CA State University).  This is just solidifying my *shrugs* feelings about the cost of college. 

DL College News

January 12th, 2023 at 04:04 pm

DL(17) was officially accepted into the local State college.  They give very high priority to local high school students.  I think it only took this long because their business college is impacted.  He was getting a little stressed that his less studious friends were getting immediately accepted.  So I know he is relieved that it is official.

I think there's probably a 90% chance he will stay home and go to this college.  Has been leaning that way as more of his friends are choosing to go to this college.  

This is the only college he applied to.  His first choice (was) a Bay Area community college. 

With Federal tax credits and state middle class grants, we are talking $6,000 for his 4-year tuition.  (Full sticker price is $32,000).  

This is why we did not spend decades saving up for college.  The kids also both received ~$30K from in-laws for college.  I knew this would cover a 4-year degree.  I've been basing this off of full sticker price (in-state).  Projecting future college costs (in the past) and concluding that $30K would cover tuition.  I have never counted on tax credits that come and go.  I had no idea we'd get so much middle class state aid.  So pretty much we had set aside the full sticker price but are not paying anything close to that.

2022 Goals Met

January 2nd, 2023 at 02:16 pm

I am memorializing goals in my sidebar.  I kind of like the format I used last year, so will stick with that.

Pay cash for college 

$10K to Savings 

Final tally was $11,412.  The plan was to use this money to pay cash for college.  At the end of 2022 we had roughly -$0- cash plus emergency funds.  So that's about how it sorted out.  That we had just enough to cash flow college.

$2K to Investments 

Funded with snowflakes.

I topped off with $100 from MH's income, to make the full $2K.

9% Income to Work Retirement Plans 

MH and I both contribute the minimum for 401k match.  The 9% includes employer contributions.

$12,000 to IRAs 2022 

Done.  We won't fund until we do our taxes and the year is over.  But we did end the year with an extra $12K set aside for IRAs.  This is mostly thanks to annual cash gift from in-laws.

Bonus Goal that wasn't in my sidebar:

Extra to Mortgage 

We threw my bonus and gift money ($8,000) to the mortgage to pay down the balance to $99,999.  Woohoo!

The $8,000 extra payment shaved off 1 year of payments and $4,600 interest.

Why $8,000?  I did want to hit the psychological milestone of being done with six figure debt.  But this also puts us down to a total of 32 years of mortgage on our current home.   While my bare minimum goal is to knock that down to 30 years, the recent big chunks will allow me to put the mortgage on the back burner during these college years.  I can whittle down the last two years with much smaller snowballs.  I guess my bigger goal is to not (feel the need to) throw bigger chunks to the mortgage for a while.  This goal was satisfying on many fronts.

This was just more of a hope or a wish, versus anything that we would have been able to achieve with our income.  It wasn't on my sidebar, accordingly.  

Edited to add:  We ended up funding only one IRA in 2022 ($6,000).  I used the other $6,000 for Invisalign for myself.  It was a rather last minute decision in early 2023.  I would have done this instead of the mortgage, if I had known sooner.  I wanted to reflect in goals, but as I type it out, the money was saved.  It was just redirected at the last minute. 

College Stuff

December 23rd, 2022 at 02:28 pm

I transferred over a whole whopping $136 to MM(19).  $78 for 30 days of groceries (???) and $58 for his one way train ticket home.  His girlfriend gave him a ride back to school after Thanksgiving break.

To be fair, he charged up ~$25 on my Target card that I just paid for.  (Might have included non-grocery expenses that I'd expect him to pay for.)  & he told me MIL bought him some groceries but he made it sound like it was only $10 or $20.  (That he didn't really need anything, the weekend she visited.)

The girlfriend is feeding him a lot.  I was planning to get her a grocery gift card for Christmas.  Because she never accepts money (for gas or anything.)  I asked MM if her parents were paying for her groceries, wondering if that wasn't very exciting gift for her.  (Though maybe I owe her parents, in that case.)  But MM(19) told me that she was getting financial aid for her groceries.  I share because I think MM(19) is greatly benefitting from her free food.

MM(19) is applying for a RA position.  Fingers crossed!  I never in a million years would have guessed one of my kids would want to be a RA.  & honestly, not even really sure what his motivation is.  He gets "free" room and board regardless (we are paying).  His ultra frugal genes are his motivation, I guess.   & I think he just wants to be more independent. Unfortunately, is going to make housing really difficult (scrambling last minute re: very impacted housing) if he doesn't get the position.  But I am feeling pretty zen about it.  I can be zen for the chance to save a bajillion dollars.  Will see...  

We did just get DL(17)'s State college application submitted.  We had the nice surprise that his high school will pay for one CSU application.  (They are trying to figure out what to do with extra pandemic funds.)  I put $70 on the credit card but should eventually get a reimbursement for that.  He is just applying to the local State college.  It would have just been a check box to apply to our alma mater too (another State college) but we missed the deadline and that ship had sailed.  I didn't realize that A - the local state college extended the deadline & B - few other CSUs seemed to do the same extension.  DL(17) has been resisting (even visiting the college), so it's not a big loss. 

Edited to add:  Already received $70 reimbursement.  That was fast.

Financial aid is sorted for MM(19).  Phew!  

I am ready to sit down and sort all things college finances for MM(19).  It's plausible he could get more scholarships this year, but if he does I'd probably just give the money back to him.  I am preceding with the info that I have to-date, which is probably accurate.

Net tuition for the year is $4,100.  I will pull that money out of MM's gifted college funds when I pay spring quarter fees.  That is about a wash with the rent that will be due.  

We hadn't touched MM's money yet.  But he had free tuition last year.  I just hadn't touched it this year yet because financial aid was so up in the air.  Now that it's sorted, I like how this year is pretty much done and paid for already.  But I expect in the future I will just reimburse ourselves as we go.

I started this post a bajillion years ago but just have been slammed with work.  I figured I'd circle back and at least get this posted.

MM(19) did make it home last night.  Phew!  He had a blast, working on the parade float.  I don't know when, but when we can all sit down and look at some of his pictures...  I will share a behind the scenes photo.  


November 25th, 2022 at 05:14 pm

Pre-Thanksgiving was Drama Drama Drama.   But the day ended up very nice and peaceful.

Long story short, hell froze over and MH agreed not to do Thanksgiving with his family.  Of course his mom can't let it go, so it was a lot of drama the days prior.  (I don't think he's ever missed a Thanksgiving.  They have no concept that I have a family too, that MH has his own family, etc.)  I think the worst of it was Wednesday, when I was blissfully out of town.  If I was home, MH would have been venting to me all day.

**Edited to remove my own venting.**

I wish we could have given the Holiday to my parents, but they just aren't up to it at this point.  So we decided to have a peaceful day at home.  Is what all of us wanted more than anything at that point.  But we had sent off MM(19) to his girlfriend's Holiday and they ended up inviting us.  We felt obligated to go.  Most particularly because they had for months planned a summer BBQ that we had to cancel last minute when MH had COVID.  & it turns out that they usually have a bigger Thanksgiving with family but had stayed home due to medical reasons.  So they really appreciated having more mouths to feed.

The girlfriend and the Dad are both really good cooks.  We ate very well.  They seem to be a very relaxed bunch and we really enjoyed meeting them.

I tried a new/simple cookie recipe that was amazing:

I am looking forward to the peaceful long weekend.  Nothing planned today, though we have some appetizers to eat through (that we had bought for the in law Thanksgiving.)  

This weekend will be college stuff.  Have some financial stuff to go through with MM(19).  & DL(17) is going to be applying to one college.

We toured the local State college a few weeks ago and were all very pleasantly surprised.  It's a really nice campus.  I think we've always been kind of "meh" on the local colleges, being from the Bay Area.  & I mean, they didn't have any accounting programs when we moved here.  I abandoned my Graduate degree with the move.  Lord knows we didn't see the point of studying engineering here (with all the Bay Area schools to compare).  So I booked the tour and MH and DL(17) were kind of, "Why are we here?"  Because I like back up plans for my back up plans, and wanted DL(17) to know what his options are.  We all ended up really liking the campus.  So he may just stay at home his first year of college.

I keep trying to get him to tour my alma mater (which has an amazing accounting program) but DL(17) is really resisting.  He is prickly and I honestly think he would just hate it (it's in the middle of downtown).  But he wants to study accounting and I think he needs to at least set foot there and guage how he feels about it.  If he viscerally hates it, I am totally fine with that.  But it would be nice to know for sure.  (He absolutely could not stand MM's college campus.  If he didn't have such a negative visceral reaction, I'd suggest he just goes to community college down there and room with his brother.  I suppose it is another community college he could look into, but I think the distance is a bit much for him.)

We were out of town Wednesday because we went on a tour of the community college he is interested in.  In the Bay Area.  It was also a beautiful campus.  Both these campuses are woodsy, and he likes that.  

DL(17) has been overly fixated on college costs.  I told him to let it go.  The $8K state college is only $1,500 (annual tuition) after Federal tax credits and State middle class grants.  I told him the difference was negligible (versus community college) and that is why I personally didn't bother with community college.  I can't speak for MH but I expect it was the same for him.  I told him this at the beginning of the State college tour and I think he went into it with a more open mind.  It might cost $1,500 more per year but we can afford it and that $1,500 buys a lot of amenities.  Also, I've said before, if he starts out at State he is more likely to stay there.  So bigger picture I really think it's the most bargain option for his degree.  He's more likely to just start out at home (no extra room/board) *and* he is more likely to just finish his 4-year degree at the very affordable college.  Once he has that momentum going.  

College Updates

October 18th, 2022 at 02:27 am

We did a $80 grocery run when we dropped off MM(19) at college.  After the first 30 days, his credit card cycle closed with $70 in grocery costs.  Will see how it shakes out during the next few months.  But I would be happy to keep it at $200/month or lower.  This sounds like it might work out.   

CA state funding came through and I have a better idea of real tuition costs this year.  First, the state is raising middle class funding over the next few years.  I've heard our $2K grant would probably go up to $3K this year.  It ended up being $3,400.  Woohoo!  & might be more next year?

Even better, the CA money is now showing up for all 4 years.  Initially he had so many credits they labeled him as a sophomore last year and only was showing 3 years of grants.  I am sure that was probably right.  Some majors can get out in 2-3 years if you start with a lot of credits.  But that's just not going to be the case for his engineering degree.  So I don't know what to think, but now it's showing up for all 4 years.  So that's +$3K I really was not expecting.

We've whittled the cost of MM(19)'s degree (tuition) down to $14,500. 

Edit:  MM and his girlfriend are each cooking a meal once a week, and then leftovers are carrying them through.  It sounds like girlfriend may be doing even more cooking/baking (she loves to cook) and I think I will try to buy her a grocery gift card for Christmas.  She just refuses money (any time we have offered her reimbursements for gas, food, anything).  So I am trying to figure out how to put some money back in her pocket. 

& I mean, that's just the big food effort.  MM(19) loves baked potatoes (cheap/easy) and told us he was buying some frozen meals.  If he went straight from home to college/apartment, I would not expect that at all.  But I guess he can tolerate some of the frozen meals when the alternative is (terrible/expensive) campus food.  It's all relative.


September 24th, 2022 at 02:20 pm

Did you see that Frugalwoods moved up from a $10K vehicle to a ~$35K+ vehicle?  😱

I am sure they could easily afford it, and didn't have much choice.  But I just couldn't even imagine wrapping my brain around that.  Yikes!

I am starting to feel like a genius for pulling the EV car trigger.  If it allows us to wait out this used car insanity.  We were so spoiled by the decades that most people turned up their nose at the idea of buying used. 

Oh yeah, so I looked it up out of curiosity a couple of weekends ago.  Our car (that we paid $17K for) is now going for $30K.  With the +20K miles we've added to it since we bought it.  That's crazy!  I probably had looked that up a few days before Frugalwoods posted about their new car purchase.

I am not sure what MM(19) will do.  Maybe both kids.  But the car they have has many years left in it.  & I am not as concerned about DL(17), who has a car that he can probably drive through college years.  

We actually had a discussion about it a few weeks ago because MM started expressing more interest in getting a car his last two years of college.  But he later clarified he was just thinking ahead to next summer and knows he won't just have a car to take to work, if DL(17) is using their shared car.  I had told him that honestly MIL would probably just let him borrow her car for the summer (if she doesn't just give it to him).  & then he said something like, "Why do they need two cars anyway?"  Good point.  & FIL might not be driving much longer anyway.

MIL had already voiced wanting to give her car to MM(19).  It's just when she said that before, it was completely ridiculous.  The car is now a few years older (I have no idea how old, I don't remember at all, but it's just a little less ridiculous at this point).  They came into some money last year and are thinking about going electric.  

If he needs/wants a car at college, just depends where he ends up living. **

I should probably get quotes for full coverage on the gas car and run through the math.  The whole point of the old beater is not having to get full coverage on a new driver ($$$$$).  But...  With this absurd used car market.  It might be extra peace of mind for the first 6-12 months that DL(17) is driving on his own.   I will ask for quotes when we get him coverage.  & I'll have to look up what that car is going for these days, to help guage if the extra insurance would be worth it.   Will see.  I'd still have DL(17) pay for the basic insurance, but we'd pay for the extra coverage if it made any financial sense.  Note:  The car was worth ~$4,000 pre-pandemic; we've put very little miles on the car.  $5K was always our cutoff for full coverage.  It's probably pretty borderline at this point. 

**Reminds me:  MM(19) has a lead on dirt cheap housing.  1/3 of what we are paying now.  !!  His girlfriend has some job on campus that comes with housing deal.  I told him to let her be the guniea pig this year, but I was intrigued.  So far...  I don't know.  I guess there's been a lot of problems but some of that is one person didn't work out and they have an opening.  I think this year is set and fine and paid for already.  But just thinking to future years.  I am intrugued but this is a situation where there are obviously trade offs.  It's not like my housing hack in college where I paid about as much for a *better* living situation.  She's putting up with a lot for the cheap housing.  We may be able to figure that out too (pay less for better housing options), but it's just harder being 300 miles away.  Unless he's just able to figure it out on his own.  Which is what I did. I am sure he can figure it out but he also doesn't have the financial motivation.  If his parents weren't paying, he'd already have the job with the cheap rent.   I am mostly intrigued because he will be stuck with off campus housing in the future and it sounds like a nightmare to figure out.  So if he can lock in some alternative/cheap housing, sounds good to me.

DL(17) College Plans

August 6th, 2022 at 04:20 pm

I was just putting this at the end of another post but it was getting too long and I figured I'd break out into the college category. 

Just noting where we are at with things as DL starts his senior year of high school.  Wouldn't be surprised if this is where we land, but expect minds to change over the next year...

DL(17) is starting to get all that 'senior year college apps' pressure and is starting to ask more questions.  I told him not to worry about it, since he doesn't have to deal with all the red tape and timelines (for community college).  But as he was asking questions, I recommended doing some homework re: colleges that are more in-person (his preference), looking up colleges where he wants to live, etc.

I am sure he will change his mind 10 more times.  Which is fine.  He has the time to do so.  Before this week, he's just been thinking about if he wants to stay home his first year of college, or live with relatives in the Bay Area (and has gone back and forth in recent years).  He is finding that the colleges are more abundant and higher quality in the Bay Area.  Which is probably why we never presumed he'd live at home (re: community college).  I mean, this was 1000% re: engineer child.  He clearly would have gone to community college in the Bay Area, if he went the community college route. But DL(17) seems to be leaning the same way (Bay Area), as he evaluates options.

He does want to live with SIL, so I asked him what college was around there.  He found a college I don't remember at all.  It's in a bougie zip code and has a good business program.  I can see why he is drawn to it.

So I spent the week asking people if they knew anything about this college.  No one's heard of it, but I am just talking to local people at this point, and not getting anywhere. I talked to my Dad last night and he said, "Heck yeah, I know that college.  They have a GREAT music program!"  Seriously!?  It might be *the one*.  After a long summer of just throwing himself into his music, DL(17) seems a little more open to a music minor or at least taking some music classes.  & it would be a great way to meet like-minded people in a city where he doesn't know anyone (his age).  

Our "we like backup plans for our backup plans" personalities want DL(17) to apply for State.  The application is simple.  He doesn't seem interested right now, but a lot can change in a year.

It will be interesting to see what he comes up with re: college and career counseling at his school.  Is supposed to be very good, so might come up with new options.  Also, sometimes things sound better when it doesn't come from your parents. 

College costs, for point of reference:

Community College:  FREE

This is a newer (CA) thing that mostly no one has heard of.  I am looking up this specific college (it seems to depend on college) and they have free tuition/fees/books.  Catch is you have to be a local resident.  (& a full-time student, right out of high school).  I don't know how moving factors but it sounds pretty moot.  The $1,500 annual sticker price (tuition/fees/books) would be free regardless with college tax credits.  I can see the value for struggling families and people ineligible for the tax credit.  But I don't see that it makes any difference for us personally.  No matter how you slice it, community college should be free for DL(17).  (First $2K college costs are eligible for a Federal tax credit to offset).

The 'free community college deal' does cover more than just tuition/books.  It does have that going for it.  It's just not enough to lose any sleep over if they won't count him as a resident.  

State College: $3K

Sticker price is $8K per year.  Minus Federal tax credit and middle class (CA) grant, we are looking at net $3K per year. 

I really don't care if DL(17) goes to State or community college.  Both options are well within our means, and clearly very inexpensive.  So we will encourage him to consider both of these options.  

Bigger picture, it's probably more wise to just go to State.  Odds are he'd just stay at State, if he started there.  $12,000 for the 4-year degree.  I'd push more for State, if it was just about finances.  But I think community college might be a better fit for him.  

He's not going to consider anything "expensive" or where he'd have to dorm.  Makes it much simpler.  These are just his personal deal breakers, but he might share some of our genetics.  😉  

Edited to add:  middle class grants took forever to sort out but went up 70% for the 2022-2023 school year.  If it goes up even just a little bit next year (as scheduled), we will only be paying $1,500 net for DL's first year at State.  Maybe less in future years.

Feb '22 Savings

March 5th, 2022 at 05:36 pm

Received $25 bank interest for the month of February.


Snowflakes to Investments:

--Redeemed $37 credit card rewards (cash back) from our grocery card 

--Redeemed $85 cash back on Citi card

--Redeemed $6 on dining out card


Other Snowflakes to Investments:

+ $4 Savings from Target Red Card (grocery purchases)


TOTAL: $132 Snowflakes to Investments


401k Contributions/Match:



Snowball to Savings:

+$600 MH Income


Savings (from my paycheck):

+$850 to cash (mid-term savings)


Pulled from mid-term savings:

-$5,719 College Expenses

- $500 More College Expenses

- $600 Mattress  (used MH's income towards a new mattress)


Short-Term Savings (for non-monthly expenses within the year):

+$1,500 to cash

+$  175 Insurance Rebate**

-$1,380 Various Insurance

-$  260 Dentist

-$  266 Annual DMV Registration (Hybrid)

-$   80 Miscellaneous


TOTAL: -$4,723 Net Withdrawn from Cash and Investments


Hybrid Miles Driven February:  704

Fuel Costs: $20 Electricity 

Note:  I'd estimate my commute at 800 miles per month.  Short month and a couple of days off.

Electric (EV) Miles Driven February: 486

Fuel Costs: $14

Note:  I don't recall any free charging this month. 

We also didn't have an opportunity yet to test out the bigger battery on a longer drive.

All charging (both cars) was done at home or at free chargers.  

Note:  I haven't noticed any gas price changes in months.  Whenever it comes up online, I look at Gas Buddy.  I think as with many things, prices are already high here and so are slow to change.  I share because in the last day our gas prices went up 50-cents per gallon!  At the super cheapie gas stations we frequent(ed).  Last night I thought it was a typo or maybe premium gas, but the other gas station shot up 40-cents today.  So it's official, our gas prices are getting crazy now. 

Of course, I don't want to pay even $4/gallon (much less $5/gallon) for my commute, which is why we bought the hybrid in the first place.  


**Insurance rebate was for disability & life insurance through professional association.  The annual rebate was much lower than usual.  I presumed that is due to the pandemic.  I later got an email confirming this.  More life insurance claims last year.

Note:  I am always lagging a month behind because any bills charged in January will be paid off February 1 and reflected in my February numbers.  I charge in one month and the next month I figure out how to pay for everything (if I need to pull anything from savings). So this update reflects January spending & February savings. 

This is mostly how it goes but I have two exceptions for this month:

1 - DMV.  Ugh!  After many many years of accepting credit card payments with no charge, they switched to charging a fee for payments.  This was before the pandemic?  Keep hoping they switch back and surprised they have not yet.  This bill is not due for a couple of months but I don't want to keep track of it, I just want to get it paid.  So I had to move money for this cash expense.  Paid in February.  Couldn't just charge it and pay it off next month.

2 - College Expenses.  Have to pay cash.  Again, could have paid later but I prefer to pay a couple of weeks early and to just pay the quarter in full (versus dealing with more frequent payments).

College Expenses: Paid for final quarter of freshman year.  This is roughly $730 tuition (will be completely offset by college tax credit) + $3K rent + $2K food. 

After that was done, MM(18) pinned me down to pay a $500 deposit for housing sophomore year.  I knew that was due soon, but thought I might have a couple of weeks of breather.  This is the only deposit I have to pay for next year?  Nothing else should be due until September. 

College Big Picture: 

A - I have money set aside to cover rent next year. 

B - Gifted funds are set aside for tuition, if needed.  Worst case sticker price is $20K for remainder of 4-year degree (tuition/fees).  MM(18) has $27K gifted funds.

C - We do also have $20K set aside to cover rent for last two years.  & we are still working towards saving college money for the next 16 months (basically spending sophomore year saving up for MM's junior year).   This is just in a "prepare for the worst" vein and our final contribution before we shift focus to DL(16)'s college expenses.

D - Waiting for scholarships & MM's summer job to sort out for more financial clarity.   

Another Note:  MH had a lot of time off work this month (just slow at work, plus some seasonal time off).    

I did throw MH's one paycheck towards the mattress; his March paychecks will pay for (most of) the rest of the mattress.  That and my raise should do it.  (I've already paid off the credit card, so technically just paying ourselves back in March).

February ended up being a really good month and will be reflected by mega savings numbers in March.  Even with the purchase of a new mattress, March should go way the other way with more savings than spending.  It was nice to enjoy some rare breathing room we put in our budget this year, so it felt a little splurge-y while also being able to keep aggressive savings goals.  I am sure the short month helped, and also just nothing really came up (by some miracle!?).  


MM(18) Money Update

February 13th, 2022 at 03:42 pm

Getting through "started but not published" posts.  This is the last one.  I did a DL(16) money update about a month ago, but here is the MM(18) update.

MM(18) had a one-month job lined up that would net about $3,500.  This was last August.  It fell through but was probably for the best.  He likely would have quit with the fires and terrible outside working conditions.  He was able to make $1,500 doing temp work in my office.  An employee went on a long international vacation and he had been helping us out the prior two years.  He was the obvious go-to for a summer temp.

No one in our families had "gone away" to college, particularly for freshman year.  So we agreed that MM(18) should not work while he gets his bearings.  It was just a lot, even if he is very adaptable and I am sure he probably would have been fine. 

In the end, we have decided that working is penny wise and pound foolish.  Probably not in the ways that would be presumed.  MM(18) would have no problem working and getting all As.  But I heard it was feasible for freshman to get very high paying summer internships.  I wasn't going to hold my breath on that one.  But it's quickly becoming obvious this is true and the *why* of this is true.  MM(18) is spending his ample free time joining clubs.  He is building an electric car from scratch and also working on the engineering side of an art installation.  Those are his two major projects.   Not only is he getting very practical experience, but he's networking.  The first few weeks of college he had already met several juniors/seniors who are moving on from their internships, and attended networking events with big name companies.  So it seems pretty pointless to work during the school year for very few dollars, when he can make $15,000 over the summer (without balancing work/school).  

Current Job Situation:  ??????  Weird re: Pandemic

I copy and pasted what I wrote about DL(16).  Just because he *can* get an internship this summer, doesn't mean much.  MM(18) told us a while ago that he didn't expect he would want to get an internship this summer.  & I mean, he was presuming they would mostly be in LA or SF.  In addition to being more difficult to get as a freshman.  We are fine with that.  I honestly don't think he will ever move home again, and so it will be nice to have him home this last summer.  

This is just a completely random/new development, but MM got a lead on an internship here and has a job interview during spring break.  It's extra random because this company is right next door to mine (shares the same parking lot).  Talk about a small world. 

Anyway, with the job falling through last summer and the pandemic and everything, I expected things to be pretty tight for MM(18).  It's been made extra complicated because he's aged out of his 7%-interest account.  That was another $500 I thought he'd have access to this school year.  But though he's clearly aged out (it says so on his statements, that the interest rate is only something like 0.02%) they are still giving him 7%!  So of course he doesn't want to touch that $500 as long as he is getting mega interest.

In the end he only spent $200 his first school quarter, and the vast majority of that was finals week when he finished like on Monday and waited all week for a ride.  He gained a girlfriend and she had her car.  So they went out shopping and went out on a date (he paid for an expensive meal).  If not for that, he probably would have spent a whole whopping $100 for the quarter.

He is enjoying the all-inclusive lifestyle (and lives in paradise).  There is no lack of things to do.  He's been back for 6 weeks and the only thing he bought was books for the second quarter.  I am just checking his bank balances.  He has about $800 left.  So he roughly started the school year with $1,000 and is left with $800 to get through the next 4 months.  I think he will survive.  During school, he's just too busy to spend money.  & I am glad he splurged and enjoyed a bit when he did have some down time.  During winter break he was recovering from wisdom tooth surgery, and his high school friends seemed mostly interested in hanging at each other's houses (I expect due to several reasons.  If nothing else, never got in any habit of "going out" during the pandemic, in addition to maybe being enticed by parents who wanted more time with their kids.  MM was offered a lot of free meals).  Whatever the reasons, he didn't spend any money when he was home.  

MM(18) also has $5,500 in super high yield savings accounts.  I just know he doesn't want to touch any of that if he doesn't have to.

So the summer job thing is a big question mark at this point but he has some possibilities.

MIL usually gives the kids $1,000 per year for their college savings.  Because we are paying for tuition/room/board, I think I am probably going to give MM(18) this $1,000 to cover spending money his sophomore year.  Just some, "if you don't get a job this summer" insurance.  It seems the best use of this money at this point.   We already have funds set aside to cover his last 3 years of college (presuming worst case of no scholarships).  I'd rather utilize this $1K as "not having to work" money. 

2021 Goals Met

January 17th, 2022 at 03:49 am

I am memorializing goals in my sidebar.  Unfortunately, this site is not allowing me to just cut and paste my sidebar goals.  So whatever, will just put some in another format and type it out.  

Pay cash for college 

In the end, MM(18) followed in his parents' footsteps and chose a public college that is impossible to beat from a cost/benefit standpoint.  I always say that about my alma mater but MM(18) has chosen a similar degree/route (at a different CA State college).

I suppose we didn't have any idea where he would end up last January, but we never considered any colleges that we'd have to go into debt over.  

$12K to Savings 

Final tally was $16,000.  The plan was to use this money to pay cash for college.  At the end of 2021 we had -$0- cash plus emergency funds.  So that's about how it sorted out.  That we had just enough to cash flow college (without tapping any prior years' savings/investments). 

We probably would have fared better on this goal (with unexpected unemployment funds and stimulus, etc.) but it was a really expensive medical year.  We basically saved $25,000 but spent $9,000 on medical, which nets out to $16K saved.

I hope this makes this our worst college year.  For future years we have all of MM(18)'s college costs saved (already) and this was a really one-off medical year.  

$2K to Investments 

Funded with snowflakes.

I had been feeling very "meh" about this goal.  Probably stopped throwing our snowflakes into investments once college started.  But I do count dividends and it was a really big dividend year.  That was enough to encourage me and I threw something like $250 of our windfall to top off this goal.

$1,200 to Mortgage 

I hit this goal with a lump sum at the beginning of the year.  

We then threw an extra $12,615 with the cash gift we received end of December.  

Why $12,615?  It was an even $20K mortgage paydown for the year and left just enough windfall to cover college expenses for the next 18 months.  

The $12,615 extra payment shaved off 2 years of payments and $9,500 interest.

9% Income to Work Retirement Plans 

MH and I both contribute the minimum for 401k match.  The 9% includes employer contributions.

$12,000 to IRAs 2021 ❌❓

Not sure on this one.  We sent $12K to mortgage instead.

I was very happy to get a redo.  We ended up doing 33% of my income to retirement in 2020 due to a nasty tax cliff.  Then unemployment was made tax-free retroactively and we didn't need this tax break at all.  No way I ever would have tied up so much money in 401K if I had known!  So I appreciate the redo.  Will average 21% to retirement both years, which is what is important.  Anything more than that...  Meh.  We are way too retirement heavy.

We also don't need the tax break for 2021.  Taxes ended up going way the other way in 2021.

To be re-evaluated in April.  I left it as a question mark because I just don't know.  Will see how things shake out the next 3 months.  We have until April 15th to lock in this decision.   (We are saving a lot, but MH's job is also very iffy re: pandemic surge).

Edited to add:

Also hit two longer term goals this year.  What a year!

**$500K+ in retirement funds (by age 45)

**$1 Mil+ Net Worth ✔

Note:  I didn't have a timeline for the net worth goal, it's just a nice milestone.  Retirement goal was extremely aggressive when made.  I swear that "thinking it" is 99% of the battle when it comes to goals.  Not to underscore the planning and hard work, but the aggressive goals seem to work in the subconscious background and find a way to work.

Oct 7

October 12th, 2021 at 03:58 am

October 7

$247 Hotel

$43 Lunch & Gelato

$11 Gas

$10 Electricity (Fuel)

Dinner:  Out


This is all vacation spending.  I am coming up with a grand total of about $450.  We had $9 left in our vacation budget for this year.  I was planning originally to just take DL(16) on this trip and to use MH's income to cover this.  It sounds like it will probably work out.  MH should be working next week.  (We have more than ample savings if MH's job falls through again).

We've stayed at this hotel a bajillion times over the years and have never had any problems.  But in this case, they didn't have our ocean view room.  They initially told us they downgraded us to a regular room and we were mostly *shrugs* about that.  Given the increased spending with bringing a third person on the trip.  But we stood around waiting for a long time, and they found us an ocean view after all.  Of course, this all seemed to come down to "lack of staff/new employee" issues, as with everything these days.  MH got the impression they were giving us a bigger discount but as far as I can tell they just dropped $10-$20 for the trouble.  But there were a few charges/credits on the credit card so I can see maybe we didn't receive the discount they were attempting to give us.  It's been a few days and it looks like $247 is what came through.  In addition, they gave us $50-off our next visit.  Which is really more than necessary for a little bit of standing around.

Of course, we had just had this whole talk on our beach walk in the morning.  It was never my intention to go back to this hotel after move-in.  It's just that DL(16) specifically wanted to stay here and it was going to a mom/son trip.  As we walked on the beach that morning MH said we should really just stay in Solvang the next time.  I told him, "Or the hotel right by the college."  Both of which would cost about half as much.  This beachfront hotel has free public parking and a lot of surfers park here.  I was telling MH, "We could always come over here for a beach walk, charge up the car, eat at our favorite resaturant."  Saves $100 for much of the same experience.  So of course, now we are tempted by that free $50.  We *may* use it during Thanksgiving break.  We've stayed there a couple of times after Thanksgiving because it was such a good deal.  & now we have the double reason of dropping MM(18) back off at school.  We don't have any firm plans on that though.  He has so many friends he can catch a ride from and the grandparents seem really keen on picking him up and doing most of the driving.  (They also want to keep him all week but clearly that is ridiculous.)  

We were able to charge our car overnight at the hotel.  Most these electricity providers just charge $10 at a time and then refill when you use your $10.  I just see a $10 charge.  I am looking it up and we spent $12 on electric charge ($6 x 2).  That was for 100 miles of range; 50 miles in Solvang and another 50 miles at the hotel. 

{We drove 800 miles total on this trip, about 150 miles on electric and 550 miles gas}.  

We did eat lunch and dessert at our favorite Pismo Beach place.  MM(18) was too busy with classes, so we didn't see him again or have to feed him.

We drove for 3 hours towards home and then took a break for MH's movie.  DL(16) and I spent some time with GMIL and then my parents.  We ate a late dinner with the in-laws and then got home around 10pm.  This became a more rushed trip when MH joined us.  I wasn't going to board my cat for this trip and we really needed to get home to take care of the cat.  Our original plan was to keep it looser and maybe stay another night.

We did stop for gas where we always used to stop, about half way home from the Bay Area.  We stopped to fill up at a 7-11.  We maybe haven't been there for a year?  I noticed some "7-Eleven" electric chargers.  They were comparable to gas prices, but I just thought that was incredibly smart.  I would 100% just stop and charge there.   

We were just cutting it close on gas (and had used up the electricity) so I asked MH to just put in two gallons.  Is what I like to keep in the car.  Electric vehicle recall aside, I never use gas any more.  2 gallons seems to be a sweet spot where I'd otherwise just get gas once per year.  (It will burn off a little gas in more extreme weather or during maintenance mode).  To explain why we only spent $11 on gas. 

This trip ended up being interesting in that I was feeling bad I just had no mental energy whatsoever to take DL(16) on any college tours.  Probably should have because it's his fall break this week.  But. So. Exhausted. with everything college.  Anyway, it worked out pretty well.  DL(16) viscerally hated absolutely everything about MM's college and dorm.  After about 5 minutes he just wanted to leave.  MH tells me this at some point.  MH and I never did the dorm thing, we somewhat understand.  We just aren't as moody and dramatic as DL(16) is. By itself, was probably a good experience to get him thinking more realistically about college.  He wants to go away (somewhere less urban and more rainy).  I highly doubt he will be up to that at 18, but also figure it's a bridge to cross in another couple of years.  A lot will change in 2 more years.

Anyway, MH's aunt was with GMIL (when we visited) and she used to work at a community college.  She goes on some community college spiel and DL(16) is intrigued.  She's also excited about the possibility of community college becoming free.  I guess that's being discussed politically.  I am just, "Um, it's already free."  Has been free in our state for a couple of years, and before that it cost pennies.  We have always been very pro community college but I can tell from this conversation that no one has ever really explained community college to DL.  He's kind of just, "I didn't know that, I didn't know that's how it worked."  Which I guess is where we failed, as clearly no other adult (in his life) is particularly pro community college.  Anyway, while MIL is like readying his room for him (he can live with her while he goes to college!) - she's a *lot* - I expect he may change his mind a few times during these next couple of years.  But I think it was a really fruitful trip in that I think he's getting more realistic about college options (re: what will actually work for him).  & he is intrigued by the middle ground of maybe going away to college in more of a "baby step" kind of way.  Up until this point, he's only been talking about going to college out-of-state. 

So I guess we got some serendipitous college exploration out of this trip.  

An Emptier Nest

September 26th, 2021 at 08:37 pm

We've got MM(18) all moved in at his college.  Phew!  The first week was pretty much a vacation for him.  Orientation week, with some practical orientation stuff but also a bajillion activities.  Some highlights were crawdad fishing and beach bonfires.  Classes started last week.  All my fingers and toes are crossed that the kids can stay on campus this year.  

MM(18) had never gone back to school after the pandemic started, so I can't even imagine the stimulation overload he is experiencing. 

I am personally very zen about the emptier nest.  Probably for many reasons.  MM(18) is very independent and will be just fine.  My bff attended this college and I spent many a weekend there during my college years.  So it helps that it's very familiar to me.  Also, my parents never really took us anywhere, *but* for this incredible deal of a beachfront hotel they found in the 1980s, that's about 10 minutes from this campus.  I think the whole thing would have been a lot harder if we didn't have such a familiar place to go to that first night.  We gave MM(18) about 24 hours to get settled, before we left.

I am planning a trip in a couple of weeks.  Ideally will be taking DL(16) with me.  He has never been to the college/town and would be good for him to see where his brother is living.  He asked to stay at the usual hotel and so I obliged.  But that necessitated a mid-week stay at $200+ per night versus a weekend stay at $400+ per night.  (Yeah, it's not the insane deal that it once was).  In the future we will be finding other places to stay.  In fact, MH wants to be cheap and not stay at a hotel at all (during move-in, when we visit, etc.)  I told him we were too old and well off to make that a day trip (10 hours round trip, just for the drive).  I said something like, "We aren't 18 any more."   😉  But we could probably stay with our parents for a night and make a day trip of it.  I basically set the college travel budget to -$0- once MM(18) accepted at this college.  The costs are very minimal (especially with the electric car) and can be absorbed in our regular vacation budget.  

I may be zen, but MH Is not zen at all.  He was the one home with kids, and both MM and MH have been home together mostly 24/7 the prior 18 months.  On top of that, MH just had a really rough week.  His coping clearly improved after a couple of days, even as things continued to go to heck.  *sigh*

Oh yeah, and MH was called back to work a couple of weeks ago but then that got postponed indefinitely.

I guess it's just a lot of limbo at this point.  Considering October a bit of a limbo month.  

One of the big things is figuring out the food situation in our household.  I would have guessed that MM(18) was about 50% of our household grocery spending.  I am not quite so sure now.  Besides DL(16) being picky and looking starved...  Any extra junky food I brought home has disappeared in a flash.  So I am thinking that DL(16) is just more of a stealthy eater.  Still, he is pickier with dinners.  We clearly no longer have to make dinner every night *and* double batch everything.  It's been more cooking every other night.  We are probably going to do some major revamping of our meals.  I mean if DL(16) seriously won't eat what we cook, then we will drastically change our cooking.  Feeding two middle aged people is entirely different from feeding "5,000 calories per day teenager athlete."  We don't need all the calories and so we just have a lot to figure out.  Maybe starting to mix in our future empty nest diet with "still have a very high calorie teenager" diet.  Alternating days. 

I am just waiting to see how October shakes out.  How MM's spending shakes out at college, how our grocery spending shakes out here.  If we notice any difference in our utilities, etc.  Once this starts to sort out then I can make sense of our budget going forward.

MM(18) is pretty much on his own, financially.  & I mean, we are covering tuition/room/board/medical.  I just mean anything above and beyond that.  But on the flip side, his job fell through last month and he ended the summer with about $3,000 less than we expected.  So that is why I am anxious to see how much spending he ends up doing and what he needs to cover.  Also, still trying to decide if we help him with groceries and stuff like that.  It just depends how much he is spending and how much we are saving.  If our grocery spending literally goes down by half, I could probably send him some grocery money.  It is our preference that he does not work this first quarter.  Something else to just re-evaluate mid-year.  

MM's first impressions are that he can remain uber frugal.  He's already told us he won't need a bike and that he doesn't see any reason to spend money.  It will be interesting if this still stands in another month or two.

MM has been okay with the food so far, but he also started up long distance running.  I honestly don't know if he will have enough food for that.  At home, he'd eat 5 large meals a day.  I guess that's the other thing we will have to figure out.  See if he has enough dining dollars (I already bought the biggest plan and am doubtful it will be enough).  There will be lots of tweaking everything "food" in the next few months.

& then of course, figuring out what the heck is going on with MH's job.  It is not surprising at all that is up in the air (with the pandemic) but the timing (and indecision of his employer) just sucked.  He was looking forward to going back to work and having the distraction.  

Will see how next week goes but if MH is still unemployed as of October 1, I guess we will also be going back to one-income mode.  & some of that might be shifting more financial responsibility to MM(18).  I don't know how it's all going to shake out. 

As always, the work situation is complicated.  I'd say that MH will be pretty picky until the pandemic eases and DL(16) gets his driver's license. The bottom of the barrel jobs are opening up yes, but then there's just more competition for better jobs.  His job is worth waiting out the month of October for.  If they are still delaying indefinitely or telling him nevermind, once October is ending, then it will be back to the drawing board.  Which may likely just be taking another year off.  I don't know.  I am probably more of the "screw this, just retire" mentality.  MH thinks the grass is greener and idealizes full-time work to help him deal with the emptier nest and the impending empty nest.  He is also extremely financially conservative and so wants to be working while we are paying for college.  Because of this I am sure my blog is confusing as we vacillate between these two extremes (retire or work full-time).  

College $$ Update

August 14th, 2021 at 02:35 pm

I finally got confirmation on the final piece of financial aid.  

I never expected any need-based financial aid whatsoever.  But our State has a middle class grant (if you attend a public college).  It just takes forever to process.  & the whole thing seemed very vague, but the dollar amount showed up in MM's 'financial aid' stuff this week.

This confirms free tuition for Year 1.  Woohoo!

I had actually just left it very "whatever" because I hadn't realized you had to pay tuition to get college tax credits.  So either he had free tuition or we had a college tax credit, it was going to all be the same in the end anyway.  I was guessing he'd get $2K-$4K for this State Grant. 

In the end it works out to: $6K scholarship + $2K Grant + $2K tax credit = Free Tuition Year 1.  

As to room/board...  The dining plan is a wash with what we already pay to feed that kid.  So I am not expecting to have any added expenses on this front.  

Dorms were a big question mark due to the pandemic.  They've gone back and forth if they will do full capacity and I didn't know where things landed.  Less roommates would equal more cost.  I personally would prefer less roommates and more cost.  (The dorms are far below market rent, and it's pennies more to get a solo room.  Not literally pennies, but when it comes to the market cost of housing it's just like nothing).  We were able to state that preference on the housing application.

The dorm ended up being much lower than I expected (probably went back to full capacity, after quoting us up front with 'half capacity' costs).  I had also completely forgotten about the deposit I paid with stimulus/unemployment money.  The total cost is $9,000.  He ended up with the cheapest option, and more roommates.   That does include utilities, laundry, everything.  For reference, is cheaper (substantially) than the rent I paid in San Francisco when I was 18. 

I decided to pay quarterly (this school is quarter system) because as much as I prefer to pre-pay things, there was no financial benefit to doing so.  Keeping track of a monthly bill would drive me crazy.  So quarterly will end up being the sweet spot.  First quarterly payments will be due September 1.

It works out to the following (after deposits already made):

Tuition $700 (will save this in taxes, but have to pay it up front)

Dorm $2750 

Dining $1050


Total $4,500 1st Quarter

So I will be draining $4,500 from the $12K I have set aside for College Year 1.  That looks more like $15,000 Total (for the year), but will be offsetting the $2K tuition with a tax credit.  & I expect to save $5K-ish in groceries over the next year.  So really I was estimating $12K for dorm when it only ended up being $8,500 (after funding deposit with other monies).  Which leaves a lot of cash to throw at food, if my grocery estimate is way off.  If we still have 'Year 1' money left over, that's a good start to 'Year 2'.  We will spend the next 12 months coming up with the money for Year 2. 

Our credit card bill is absurd, at $4,000 already for the month.  That's roughly $2K medical + $1,200 laptop + $500 auto insurance.  Plus regular spending.  I am going to pay off $4K-ish this week.  Was just waiting to nail down college costs before I start pulling money from savings (wanting to transfer just one lump sum).   I'd say on an average month we spend about $700 on this card.   So seeing that $4K balance like 5 days into the month...  I need to pay it down for my sanity. 

Edited to add:  Finally, I saw a tip where to figure out this CA financial aid stuff.  MM(18) had a login and so we just looked at it.  They are only rewarding him 3 years of the CA middle class grant, because he is starting technically as a sophmore.  (Which might be useful for other majors, but he can't apply any of his one bajillion credits to his engineering degree). I am writing this down here because I will never remember this.  Jotting it down for now, and will get more organized later.

MM Money Update

June 26th, 2021 at 03:26 pm

I will try to do a brief MM(17) money update.  I never got around to that.

MM(17) had about $30 left in his checking account.  I guess he estimated pretty darn well (he hasn't worked since last summer).  He also had a $200 IRS refund to deposit. 

{This does not account retirement & savings.  Probably $5K+ in his high yield savings accounts}.

In the end, we finally hired a more full-time admin assistant at my job, when MM(17) went back to school last fall.  MM had mostly been filling that role, during our busy summers.  But the admin assistant is a college student and ended up going out of the country for a few weeks.  So MM(17) has worked two weeks already and will fill in next week.  He will make about $1,500.  (He's working part-time hours, and we were also gone a few days on vacation).

The plan is otherwise for MM(17) to take the month of July off.  He has some college orientation stuff and is going to Florida with some of our family.  After that he will be 18 and we are desparate for construction site help, so he agreed to work full time on site during the month of August.  That still gives him 2 weeks (early September) to take off and prep for college.  Usually the kids start school early August, so he is really enjoying the long summer.  He will probably make $5,000, even with 6 weeks off.

The construction job will be terrible, but it will be an experience.  It sounds very likely he will have mega high paying internships in future summers (due to his college and degree choice).  

I joined a parent group for his college and is probably TMI at this point.  Information overload.  But some of the conversations have been really helpful.  The concensus seems to be that $200/month spending money is pretty average (mostly for food and transportation expense/uber).  MM(17) is far below average.  But I am fine with using the average as a starting point.  $200 x 9 months = $1,800 per year spending money.  I think he will end this summer with enough cash to cover all 4 years (and then some). 

MM(17) is a personality who likes work and independence, and can work with all A's.  That said, we all agreed he really needs to just take the first semester/year and get settled.  I wouldn't be surprised if he decides to get a job at some point, even if just a few hours per week.  But it also sounds like he is pretty well set up to not have to work at all during the school year.  

I did see that the summer job he had secured on his own last summer (that never came to be), that they had bumped their hourly rate and were offering free daily meals.  !!!  That's quite a benefit for a very hungry teenager, but I knew he wouldn't be too enthused by their junk food menu.  Anyway, I did bring it up but he told me he thought it was better to take the job with less exposure to mega amounts of people.  Fair enough. If he had chosen the other way, would have just told my boss, "Sorry, but they are feeding him every day!"  & my boss probably would have matched it anyway.  Given him an extra $30 per week or whatever.


College Set Up Funds

June 6th, 2021 at 03:48 pm

My last post was how I decided it was easier to utilize credit card rewards than scholarships (in particular, really ridiculous applications for small dollar amounts).

Then, the in-laws came up yesterday to celebrate MM's Graduation.  So I have some numbers in hand.  They had brought up cards/gifts from that side of the family.

MH's Family:  $670

(Mostly from Grandparents; some from Great-Grandparents and a Great-Aunt)

My Family: $0  

(I will be shocked if MM receives even $1 from my family.  I have by far the much bigger family, but they mostly don't seem to care that I exist.  My parents just are not cash gifters.).

Because of the state of my family, I really just didn't have any idea what to expect.  I thought MH's family was probably going to be generous, particularly his parents.  But...  I don't really have a frame of reference of what is "normal".

In fact, before this turn of events, I started to eyeball all my credit card rewards and thought I might just earmark them all (roughly another $2,000) for college expenses this year.  I don't expect to need all of it, but would raid what I need for college set up type expenses.

In the end, if I add the $300 Target gift cards I have and the $755 credit card reward that I just did (I should get that cash any day)...  

Grand Total:  $1,725

Most of that will go to a laptop, the rest to dorm expenditures.  I think this *should* cover everything.  Will see where we end up.  (Anything extra, we will let MM keep.  I suppose it's plausible that he will have more gifts than expenses). 

With the chip shortages and everything, we are leaning on MM(17) to pick out a laptop this weekend, so that it arrives in time for school.  I probably should also set a hard deadline to make dorm purchases this month.  It just keeps coming up over and over to plan ahead before popular items are sold out.  MH just happened to notice the long lag time in laptop delivery; he was pricing laptops last weekend.  I don't think we would have been this far ahead thinking about it except I was trying to decide if this credit card reward would cover a laptop purchase.  

This is just one more step in ensuring paying cash for college *and* not touching college funds.  At current, that is our goal for freshman year.  Future years, depends on grandparent gifts and MH's employment.  (100% will pay cash, no loans.  But not sure how realistic it is not to touch any college funds). We had decided to pull dorm costs from college funds, but then we had stimulus and unemployment monies to cover Freshman year, in addition to a free-tuition scholarship.  So we have gone back to Plan A, cash flowing everything.

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